Balancing Creativity and Consistency in Business Systems

intro (00:00:00) - Welcome to the Virtual CPA Success Show for creative agencies. The go to resource for agency owners looking to scale their business. Join us every week to stay ahead of the curve and position your agency for future success.

Jamie (00:00:15) - All right, Jody, I'm very excited for this episode today with Josh Munger. And I want to clear something up for our listening audience. It's that, you know, we really don't do a ton of prep for these shows. And especially when it comes to the question, just want to make sure that we're both on the same page there in our audience knows that like there is absolutely no prep when it comes to those things.

Jody (00:00:34) - Yeah, but Josh, you know, it's a fun show.I've actually been on Josh's podcast and he's been on one of our other podcasts. So this is like the third podcast that we've kind of done together and it never gets old talking about systems and really, you know, how the importance of systems and how they actually work, and yes.

Jody (00:00:55) - Jamie although Jamie is accurate on the final thing I honestly do exactly what I say at the end.

Jamie (00:01:02) - Jody would you would not lie. Yeah so we this is the second guest in a row where we've thrown a question on them and they were a little bit surprised by the question we give Josh a hard time. But yeah, Jody is 100% right. He's a great guest. And I really like the message here and talking about systems and processes because think it's important not only for agencies but for any business out there is to really sit back and think through it. And I think Josh would be a great consultant to hire for any company because this is really important for a company to succeed. But yeah, I think it's a great episode and everybody enjoy it. Hello, everybody. Welcome to today's episode. Really excited for today's show is we're going to talk about one of my favorite topics about processing systems. So I know that's a very common topic and a lot of times it's talked about at the very high level.

Jamie (00:01:46) - So I'm hoping today we go into a little bit more detail and what those processes and systems look like and how you can go about creating them. And our guest, Josh, is very familiar with this topic as he is the CEO of WTS Enterprises. So welcome to the show, Josh.

Josh (00:02:00) - Glad to be here.

Jamie (00:02:02) - And as always, we're joined by Jody Grunden, who's a partner here at Anders. So welcome again, Jody.

Jody (00:02:07) - Yep. Thanks for having me, Jamie.

Jamie (00:02:09) - All right. Josh, so why don't you give us a little bit of your background and kind of your expertise and what you're going to be talking to us about today.

Josh (00:02:16) - I'm sure. Yeah, I'll cut out most of the story. Once I started doing business consulting in my mid-twenties and going around flying from company to company trying to fix them with their inside sales, outside sales, their culture, their strategy, their financial picture forecasting, all sorts of stuff. I came to realize that when I was trying to fix these companies, a lot of the recurring problems that I would fix when I was there would come back again and again and again.

Josh (00:02:48) - And, you know, providentially I met Sam Carpenter, author of this book Work The System in Bend, Oregon, about after 3 or 4 years of consulting and realized that his methodology actually encapsulated the piece that I was missing, which was the systems mindset and also systems documentation. And so as I was working on and fixing these companies as an outside consultant, um, I was never actually documenting their sales process. I never actually documented how they did their marketing. I wasn't documenting how to recruit and hire and train somebody. We weren't actually going through and, you know, figuring out the best way to do something and writing it down. We were just training and hoping it would stick and it wasn't sticking. And so once I started working with Sam about ten years ago, we built a consulting company together. And that's what I've been doing ever since, is basically taking this book work, the system and the methodology in it, and helping business owners who are working too many hours, work less hours and simultaneously grow their companies.

Jamie (00:03:55) - Great. So the WTS Enterprises stands for work the system of connecting the dots here. 

Josh (00:04:02) - Yeah, yeah. So basically for our inner circle, they read the book, work the system, and they say, Hey, want some more? And then I do the coaching and consulting and events and, and basically try to help those small business owners grow in scale and we exclusively use that methodology.

Jody (00:04:17) - And Josh Jamie is one of our brighter team members. So just, you know.

Jamie (00:04:25) - I knew Jody was confused by look on his face. He's like, what does that stand for? So I figured, fill in the.

Jody (00:04:30) - Couldn't figure it out

Josh (00:04:33) - It's a mystery. That's a mystery.

Jody (00:04:36) - So yeah. Josh Systems are super important with every business and it seems like, you know, when we started some way back when systems were a big thing, hey, we needed everything need to be repeatable. We need to figure out ways to document and it's been like an ongoing thing for 20 years, really.

Jody (00:04:55) - I mean, we get to it. We get through what we think is perfect, and then we realize all the flaws in it. And we've got to redo the the whole process again, you know, kind of like before here. Josh, I'd like kind of like your take on your experience just with Summit. I mean, because we think we're pretty solid with our systems right now and we're probably more solid than most. But in my opinion, we can always use improvements.

Jamie (00:05:18) - Yeah, definitely we can. We can use some improvements. And I think back to when I first started and think I was with the second or third hired CFO outside of you and Adam. And at that time it was think we had really good systems around accounting, but it was creating the systems around consulting that was lacking. And so that's when I came in. I was like, okay, well how do I consult? And Jody's like, Yeah, you just be me. You just do what I do.

Jamie (00:05:41) - And okay, that's not going to work. Because we were two different personalities and two different ways to think about stuff. And so I really dove in on the systems on the consulting side. And that's what I do today is really try to create systems. So when a CFO starts, they can come in and really have some systems that can fall into of, okay, what is the backbone for doing consulting? Because consulting is as you know, it's hard, right? It's easy to say I'm a consultant, but it's hard to actually do it because there's so much it's such a wide net there. So think that's what we really worked on in the last eight nine years since I've been at some of this perfecting the process and the systems around consulting and think we're doing a good job. But obviously there's always room for improvement. So that's kind of where we're at as an organization, at least from the consulting side.

Jody (00:06:31) - And so what just kind of going into that then, what's your thoughts? Why do people or why, you know, how many people that you work with really start with no systems in place and then how many people start having tried systems and failed and you're kind of introducing it.

Jody (00:06:46) - Here's what here's why it's failed. Here's the new way of doing things, I guess.

Josh (00:06:51) - Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's a great question. And it kind of brings us to the foundation of, of the whole methodology, which is the systems mindset. And so we teach is that, hey, your systems of how you do sales or accounting or process payroll, they're already there because, you know, time is progressing and those things are happening. Somehow they're happening. And so the issue is you've never actually taken them as separate pieces. Take the time to write them down, to analyze them, possibly measure them, use them from for training, for accountability. So you're there. You just haven't actually taken the time to manage and control the systems that you've already have. And so we kind of say that it's just part of existence, right? There's a system that you go to sleep at night and you'll wake up in the morning and you brush your teeth like you're going through life and operations are happening, right? And so now with your personal life, you don't often write down step by step how you brush your teeth.

Josh (00:07:52) - Right? But in a business world, if you want to move beyond just doing it yourself organically in order to have consistency and scalability, you have to write things down, right? In some capacity. In this case, you can do video and you can do screen capture and things like that nowadays with new technology. And I would say that everybody that comes to us has tried in some capacity. But usually what happens is that they've maxed out, they've hit a plateau. They've realized, hey, you know what, Whatever I'm doing is not working. It's not working well enough. And I need to go, you know, a layer deeper and actually get these things documented for real, not just say, Oh, yeah, yeah, we got systems, we all have a way of doing things. But then, you know, I got a client right now. It's a restaurant. Yeah. They have a way of doing their various items in the restaurant, but they haven't actually written down specifically what the recipe is for any of their items and specifically how to make those things.

Josh (00:08:52) - And so what do you know? It's inconsistent. And they have quality control issues. And when different cooks and you know, and chefs come, they do it differently. And so it's and everyone kind of knows how to do it, but they don't know the exact right way.

Jamie (00:09:08) - So as a follow up question to that one, So thinking of chefs and then also thinking of, you know, a lot of the CFOs we work with and think a lot of the agencies too, when you're talking to really bright people and really creative people, sometimes the word processing system really scares them, right? Like, okay, so if you're going to make me do a system on how to grill a steak, then what if tomorrow I want to do a chicken teriyaki, right? Then how am I going to make that work? If I really want to be creative and think That's one of the things that we have with our CFOs all the time and we're talking about creating these systems is like, Yeah, I want to be able to go to a meeting and be myself and really deliver the best product that I can.

Jamie (00:09:42) - So how do you build a system but also give the people within those system the flexibility to kind of be themselves and bring their own flavor to the job?

Josh (00:09:52) - Yeah, that's a great question. And you're right that usually the most creative, the most ambitious, the most entrepreneurial problem, some people usually rise to the top, especially in small businesses. Right? And they and it's because of their ability to think on their feet solve problems and react. But most of business doesn't have to be that way. You know, like the way you mail out checks doesn't have to be this creative, problem solving complex thing. It can just be done more and more efficiently the same way with tweaks along the way. And so we want is those people who are the leaders ambitious, they call them like the business development people, the innovators to be at the top. And yeah, New horizons expand, go for that. But then the day to day work, like how we answer the phone shouldn't be a creative experience every day.

Josh (00:10:40) - We should just know this is the way we answer it because we want to solve this problem and the fastest way to deliver the best value. Let's actually I'm thinking of this oil change. That company that I was working with. Like, let's just do it better and faster and higher quality. We don't need to be like, you know, reinvent the wheel. And then once you standardize the best way to do everything, then you need to use those creative minds to tweak the systems, modify them, and then expand into other territories. So once like our core business is figured out, let's expand to other business opportunities and other business problems we can solve. I had this one creative agency I was working with that did like labels and designs for products like product labels and how do I systemize? This is creative every single time. And I said, Well, you have these core clients and let's just pick a client. We picked a client, it was a fertilizer company. And I said, Okay, what is this client like? Have you ever asked them, okay, do you like these kinds of designs with these kinds of formats, with these kinds of styles? Okay.

Josh (00:11:41) - Now that you know that instead of going back and forth and back and forth with a client with ten different designs over many weeks now, what do you know? He can go back and forth with his client for a couple of days, which is a couple of designs, and save himself a ton of time and a ton of money and get better designs faster because they actually this is very simple, right? They have design guidelines like they actually know, hey, these are the guidelines for our brand and what do you know? It's more efficient. And now we can be creative within those boundaries and get more work done faster instead of just, you know, every single time. It's an original and every single time it's, you know, we're going to surprise them and wow them. Well, um, maybe at first when you're developing the relationship with this client, but now it's you need to, you know, have a value production scheme that doesn't require you personally to do the designs, but your team to do the designs.

Josh (00:12:32) - And you could expand into other, you know, other arenas, other clients, other industries and expand your business. And so once he realized that you actually could, you know, put controls on the work and therefore come up with a system to come up with designs faster and better, he realized that his loose creativity was actually slowing down his value production.

Jody (00:12:58) - Kind of bringing that. Yeah. No, I love that point. The question I would have would be is that we preach verticals to clients all the time. You know, hey, you got to get into a vertical. You got it. You know, the niches and wealth and riches are in the niches, all that kind of stuff. And, you know, when we develop a process for that vertical, how detailed do you want to how detailed do you want to get? Like, here's how we start a vertical and here's how we move into it. So we can say consistent like you're talking about. Um, because I could spend hours and hours and hours detailing everything out and then nobody would read it.

Jody (00:13:36) - Um, or is it worth all that time to go through that or should it be more outlined buckets or should it be more graphical? Or how would you do something as simple as, Hey, here's starting a new vertical, you know, whatever that vertical might be from start to from start to finish?

Josh (00:13:55) - Yeah. I think that a couple of ways to think about it or approach problem like that is that we're all on a train, right? Like no one's life can just pause and stop and you can build out this amazing system that fits this perfect vertical is your systems are going to get improved with time. They're going to get tested with your clients and the marketplace. And so you need to start with whatever, wherever you're at, right? So wherever you're currently working, you start working your systems like I've got a client right now that does copywriting. And so when I first working with them, what we can do copywriting for anybody because it works amazing. And I said, That's great.

Josh (00:14:34) - Well let's which clients really care about copywriting that's going to, in this case, provide the best value. Okay. Well these certain verticals seem to really know about that. Okay. Which clients are going to pay the most for that? And then what can you do to develop a system to help those clients beyond just I or any other writer? And this took him on a process or a voyage, let's just say, of customizing the writing process. We went from one writer himself to 100 writers and he broke apart the interview in the client interview, you know, studying the marketplace, the how do we learn their voice to how do we build these pieces? And so the systems got built as they were delivering the value to the clients, which then became this flywheel of, well, more clients want to work with us, and the clients that work with us want to get more services and the services they get they're willing to pay more for. So it all just kind of worked to improve the systems, which then got them more clients, which then they wanted more work, which then they were willing to pay more, which then you could find a better writers which they can invest in your system.

Josh (00:15:39) - So I mean you get the idea is that it just has to start somewhere. It starts with an owner or a leader saying strategically, we're going to be systems driven. Maybe we're not at all right now and we're going to document them and maybe we're not at all right now. And so, hey, we're working with this market. Let's what are we doing tomorrow? Oh, tomorrow we're going to go in and meet the client's great. Well, we probably should write down how do we do that to have an effective, you know, discovery call. Okay, What's our next thing we do with them? Well, we start to draft ideas. Okay. What is the best way to generate these ideas for the most value for the client, but the least cost for us? And like you said, Jamie, you can start with an outline and just some ideas. Just jot them down on paper and then, hey, we work that out and there's actually some things we learned by doing it and we'll write those things down too.

Josh (00:16:28) - And a big thing for us is not let's build out an SOP library just to do it so we can franchise or something like that. It's let's build a strategy based on document systems. Let's build a culture that actually wants to do this and be a part of this to make a company of continuous improvement. And then let's just give them the tools to do it. And a big part of Sam's book is how do we make it so simple and so easy that, you know, the newest employee who has only been with the company for one day can be a part of following and contributing to those systems and innovating on them and also enjoy working there. And, you know, that's difficult to do in a day. But if you've decided as a leader, you want that to be part of the culture, then it can happen.

Jody (00:17:17) - So from my if I'm understanding that correctly, then so what you're saying is if we're if we're developing the system approach to and I use the example of, hey, creating this vertical, you would start with really the strategies and the thought behind it and kind of go from there.

Jody (00:17:33) - Is that right?

Josh (00:17:33) - Yeah, yeah, definitely. And don't start at the end. Like, hey, here's the system for how we put the cherry on top, you know, start from the beginning. Like, Hey, what's going to be our system to maybe attract this client? You know, like, what are we going to do to, you know, market them? What are we going to do to sell it to them? What are we going to do for proposals then? So you're going to work in a linear fashion. Don't start at the end. Start with the beginning, and then you're going to build your systems as you go. And if you're already entrenched with a vertical, you're going to start with whatever you're currently in the middle of doing, because that's probably where the biggest pain point is or the biggest ROI is because we're doing this right now. We'll get ROI right now if we do this right now. And so I really like people to not think of it in terms of theoretical, but, you know, this is happening right now, so let's document the system for this.

Josh (00:18:22) - And you're definitely right that, you know, the riches are in the niches, so to speak, because that's probably the biggest thing I do with design agencies and these creative agencies is whether they do websites or they do advertising is that. They end up being too broad at first. And then if we can really, you know, focus them in on certain industries, like one of my website building companies just focuses on the construction materials industry. And once he started building websites, then you realize you could do some advertising with some advertising and do some copywriting. And so like you can add on additional services to help a vertical. And that's what's really giving him stability and profitability and scalability as opposed to before just doing websites and advertising for just whoever. Right. Which was way less valuable for the clients because they weren't as good and he couldn't charge as much because they weren't as good. And so it just really hurt their growth beforehand.

Jamie (00:19:24) - So there's two things you talked about here that I'm curious if I about them.

Jamie (00:19:28) - So the first thing that I see a lot of times with building systems and this is either internally or with our clients is, you know, think oftentimes, you know, perfect is the enemy of good. Here, I'll sit with the client or I'll sit with one of our teammates and be like, All right, let's document this system. And like, yeah, we wait three months because I'm not quite where I want to be with it yet. Can't we just wait for the system to be perfected? And I think what you're saying is, is like, now's the time to do it and think the other part of that is, is system documentation and system Building a system or working the system never ends. Right. Just like think it's taken us, you know, several years to go back and document all our systems and say how we do things. You can kind of go back to the beginning and look at that first system you created and a, it's probably changed and B, you could probably get more specific with it.

Jamie (00:20:09) - And like one of the things you mentioned a little while ago where you were talking about your client that had the one client that, you know, when you're looking at their labeling, they really want certain styles so you can kind of get down to two. And that's a very specific system you build. And think back to my days when I was a working multiple clients. I'd have one client that all it took was me coming to that client asking one question, Hey, what's new? And I'd have an hour long meeting with them because they would answer that question. They'd have a bunch of side topics. They would do this and they would do that. And then I have another client if I'd ask, what's happening? They say nothing, and then meeting would be over. So you had to kind of work those two clients completely different. And that's where your systems can keep evolving and keep getting better as you can start at the broad. Okay, this is how we serve a client, but then you can have each individual client have their own systems that really work through them.

Jamie (00:20:54) - And so guess that's kind of two points I took from your conversation. Anything I missed or misunderstood on those two points?

Josh (00:21:00) - No, that's exactly right. With consulting, definitely. It's much more nimble, Right. And so having a framework to work off of is great. And but ultimately, as a consultant, you're going to provide value by person to person customizing your approach to help them the most. Right? That's why they're asking for a true expert. Right? Whereas if you're going to, I don't know, McDonald's, like there's no customized approach. It's just like you're just ordering this thing and you're getting this thing. So depending on the context of who you're working with, an attorney or a CFO, um, the way you approach a system is going to be different in terms of detail. And so we'll oftentimes call those guideline procedures so they're not, you know, you're not like a robot, like this is what I do every single time. But they're like, okay, our overarching goal is to gather this information and to solve this problem.

Josh (00:21:58) - Now, here are some approaches that have worked well. These kinds of questions and these types of meetings and this type of template has worked well. So work within these boundaries and then, hey, you're going to learn some things. And like you said, then if you have high value clients, you're going to make some customizations for each client to provide the best value. But then a new CFO, let's say if you get sick for a long period of time, could come in and take your notes and take your templates and your guidelines and say, okay, I understand how, you know, I can understand how you're working with this client, how Jamie's working with this client, and they can immediately step in and start working with the client. That's really the one of the benefits of systems is that it's allows for consistency and also allows for transferability and for hiring and for training and all these things. And Jamie, you mentioned is that when someone news coming on board, you don't have to have it all fully documented and fully baked in.

Josh (00:22:56) - This is you know, a lot of times our clients are like, well, once we're ready, we'll start working with you. And I'll say, Well, are you going to hire someone in the next few weeks? They're like, Yeah, well, okay, let's start you audio or video or screen capture recording kind of how those things are happening now so that when the new person comes on board, they can have some sense of doing it. And if they're starting tomorrow, how about as you're training them, you record how to do certain things, so at least you're starting to build up a library of best practices. And of course they're going to refine it with time. But I think most people are just there waiting until that perfect time when they know exactly how things are going to happen and that time never exists. It's never going to. There's never a good time. There's always something more urgent. Definitely the documentary systems. There's always and then. And so you can always find a way to get quicker ROI.

Josh (00:23:49) - You know, day to day, week to week, then you can in documenting your procedures. And so we really want to hopefully help owners think long term about actually just think about one of my clients right now where he has this electrical, electrical contracting company and he didn't have time, super busy, super busy. And I said, just record how you're doing orientation with your new apprentice electrician. And he's like, Ha, I'm using a cell phone. The sounds bad, the lighting's bad. You know, I didn't really do a good job presenting to them during orientation. It was like an all day orientation. He recorded it anyways, and then he's like, I'll do a better job next week because he had another apprentice coming on board. And lo and behold, he's really busy and he says, You know what? I'm just going to watch all the videos. So immediately it saves him eight hours of his time, even though it wasn't like a, you know, a perfect you know, but it was a system like orientation is going to happen again and again and again.

Josh (00:24:43) - Why don't you get something recorded? And, you know, next week he saved eight hours because of it. So immediately got a pretty good ROI on it.

Jamie (00:24:55) - Great. So yeah, love the summary there. And so now we're an hour to the time of the show. We get to ask a fun question. And so as we're talking through systems, I'm going to kind of stay on that pattern, but I'm going to go I'm going to go personal. So I think, as you mentioned, like in our personal life and our personal days, there's things we just do every day. And you might not even think of them as systems, but I'm sure those things that we really appreciate. So I'm going to ask each of you guys, what's that part of your day that you just love? The part of the day that, you know, you do every day and you know that, okay, when this happens, it's going to be one of the favorite parts of my day.

Jamie (00:25:25) - So what's that one system that you do every day that you really appreciate and have really makes? If you don't do it, the day is not going to be good. So I'll start with you, Josh.

Josh (00:25:34) - Okay. I was going to just tell you to start, you know, start with Jody. Shoot. All right.

Jamie (00:25:38) - So Jody looked really confused as to start with a good time to think. Yeah.

Josh (00:25:45) - You know, for me, I mean, starting the day with prayer. So my day is not good if I don't do that. So Bible prayer and then a new tweak I've added, which is my wife's usually asleep, is to write her a note. And so when she wakes up, you get to see a note of encouragement. So that's my new system and it's worked well for the last few weeks. And so I'm trying to keep that one up. But yeah, it's kind of like a foundational system. But yeah, our personal lives are very system driven by my family because I work from home, we homeschool our kids, my wife's home, so we're home all the time.

Josh (00:26:20) - So we have like little checklists and systems and ways to try to dial in our days as efficient as possible. And, you know, that's my favorite topic to talk about really, is personal systems.

Jamie (00:26:32) - Okay. I asked you a question and then hopefully Jody and his wife don't listen to this. This podcast. You're setting this up for failure here.

Jody (00:26:40) - No.

Josh (00:26:41) - No, I need to.

Jamie (00:26:42) - It's Jody. What about you?

Jody (00:26:45) - So after I write my little love note to my wife, I work out just about every day. And so basically, the thing that I do is just kind of planning what I'm going to do for that day. And it's kind of funny that you mentioned systems. You know, for me, I just can't go to the gym and look at stuff and say, Oh yeah, I'm going to do that, that and that today. And I've got to kind of sit down and figure out, Hey, yesterday I did abs, today I'm going to do shoulders or whatever that might be and kind of sit down and, hey, here's the the five things that that I want to to work on five machines I want to work on to develop that part of their body.

Jody (00:27:22) - But then the curveball happens when you're in the gym, as everyone knows. If for those that go to the gyms is that you've got this great plan in place, then you find out that machine that you really want to work on is full and people are on it all the time. And so now what do you do? What's the next step? How do I adjust to that? And so it's a constant adjusting to it. And the nice thing about is if you know, in going through it, I feel really super prepared for the day because I try to do that first thing in the morning. Like I said, after I write my wife that note and then and and from there, when I get done, I feel ready to go. And for for the days that I don't, you know, I feel tired. I feel sluggish. You know, things just don't just don't seem to be going the normal way. And so it's, you know, I completely see where I'm thinking through it.

Jody (00:28:14) - I completely see where that's, you know, that's probably the foundation of a good day for me is, is, you know, having that those first two steps.

Jamie (00:28:24) - Yeah, that's it's funny because my my son is, is 14 now and he's starting to lift weights. And so he's been I've been I've been taken to the gym and kind of teaching them and how many times that happens where he's like, I really want to do the curl machine. We go over there and there's like a guy there and you can tell he's got the music on. He's not going to move for another 15 minutes. My son's like, Let's just wait for him. Like, no, that's not how the weight room works, dude. Like there's a thousand other bicep lists we can do. Let's go find another one. So it's like, yeah, teaching that way to be to adjust your workout plan as you go as has been has been key for me. It's a really simple system, but it's every morning is a little different for me.

Jamie (00:28:57) - I do always work out, but the type of workout I do is a little bit different. Sometimes I go play basketball, sometimes I go lift, sometimes I just go for a walk. But the one thing for me that is 100% consistent when I wake up is pouring a glass of water and drinking it like that to me is like and it just it wakes up my brain, it wakes me up. It really makes me feel ready for my workout. So that's the one thing like, again, instantly when I wake up, the first thing I'd do is hop out of bed, get a cup and fill up, you know, two and a half cups of water and try to get that drink before I leave the house. That's the wake up system for me again, no coffee, nothing like that. It's just it's just getting that water in my body right away. So and then again, obviously I do that. And then I read a wonderful letter to my wife as well.

Jamie (00:29:33) - And for that I am next to her.

Josh (00:29:36) - So you guys caught me off guard? No. Was excited. It hasn't always been that way. I'll put it that way.

Jamie (00:29:46) - Just say control C and control V every morning and it's like the same letter. Just kind of copy and paste some day before. So it's totally clear for me. And Chad has helped out a lot in that area.

Jody (00:29:58) - Yeah, it does it automatically for you.

Jamie (00:30:03) - Why do I love my wife today?

Josh (00:30:05) - That's a good question.

Jamie (00:30:07) - Cool. So, yeah, this has been a great episode. I know we gave you a little bit of hard time here at the end. Josh probably was like, you're used to taking that.

Josh (00:30:15) - Yeah.

Jamie (00:30:16) - So, yeah, let's kind of give a final thoughts to our listeners. Again, we really skimmed on systems here why they're important, but we covered a lot of topics. I'd love for our listeners to kind of have that final thought of why it's important or how it's important or what steps they can take.

Jamie (00:30:29) - So we'll start with you.

Josh (00:30:29) - Josh Yeah, sure. Well, you know, call to action, you know, get this book. You know, I didn't write it, so I won't make any money if you get it, but I do have a summary of it at enterprises and that's my big, big thing is, you know, get, get the book. If you're struggling with working too many hours in your business and you're also don't have that top line or bottom line that you thought you should buy now, then I would say I would encourage you to to get that book. And of course, if you need help, reach out to me. And I think that hopefully this talk encourage you, that there is a way out of that trap of being stuck in your business. And it might not be hyper exciting, but there's a plan and it works. And so for those who want to go deeper, you know, let me know.

Jamie (00:31:22) - Awesome.

Jamie (00:31:23) - Jody. Final thoughts from you?

Jody (00:31:25) - Yeah.

Jody (00:31:25) - With systems, I think, you know, and we talked to a lot of people where they can't get out of their own way. You know, you've got the owner of the company that still being a producer for the most part. And the biggest thing apart the biggest thing about that is that I just feel they don't have the systems in place. When they can hand something down to somebody and feel comfortable that they're going to do a good job. And that's where systems really come into play, you know, because as owners, we want to be super efficient, you know, And we know that by handing it down, we're not going to be we're going to be super consistent. And we know that if we hand it down, it's not going to be consistent or scalability. We know it's not going to be scalable. But when you have the systems in place, I think you can accomplish all of those. Scalability is that one of the biggest factors of growing.

Jody (00:32:11) - You need to be able to grow and be able give that consistent and most efficient means of, you know, of basically delivering that service or product. And I think that's where  Josh comes into play where he can hop in and identify those issues and really kind of help through that process. And so, you know, we've like I said, we've been doing our running our business for over 20 years and that's always a main, main topic. You know, hey, how can we make it so that it is all the above? And I think that's the biggest play for Josh If you don't have a Josh in your life, you definitely need to get one. And I think that's important because we can't do it by ourselves. And we always say that, Hey, we're going to create this monster by ourselves and do it. We always come up with reasons why we don't. And I think that's where a third party coming in, like Josh can really kind of help out and really kind of force you to to do what you're planning on doing anyways.

Jamie (00:33:05) - Yeah, no, I definitely agree with that. And I think the other part is too is like I think, you know, a couple of things Josh said here is of course I go to the most complicated systems and like help me create a system around our services or help me create a system around our sales process. And those ones sometimes are a little more complicated. So I think what I've found with business owners is if you just start with something simple like what? Checking the mail each day, okay, how does that process work? Or just document that system? And as you think through that system and you think through documenting it, A, the system will most likely change and you'll add some efficiencies and be like you're going to be like, Oh wow, it's nice just to have that documented somewhere. So don't need to worry about it anymore. And think once you get those first couple easy systems documented, you're going to start getting harder and harder with it. And that's where you're going to need to bring someone like Josh in and be like, okay, now I've got the ten easy processes in my company figured out, Now where do I go from here? And I think you'll see the value of just documenting those ten and you'll definitely want to take those next steps.

Jamie (00:34:00) - And so that's again, that's a lot what I heard here, which is was really appreciated. So great job guys, and really appreciate having you on the show.

Jody (00:34:08) - Hey, Josh, how can we get a hold of you if for those out there that are interested in looking in your services.

Josh (00:34:13) - Yeah, I'd have them go to WTS Enterprises, which stands for work the system but yeah wtsenterprises.com and you'll find me there that's where all of our services are in the summary download is there, too.

Jody (00:34:27) - Sounds great. Appreciate that.

Jamie (00:34:28) - Awesome. Yeah. Well, great job, guys. I appreciate having you both here.

Josh (00:34:32) - Thanks.

outro (00:34:33) - Enjoy this podcast. Visit our website, summitcpa.net to get more tips and strategy for achieving business success. We're here to be a resource in this ever changing industry.